Before this post begins, I would like to say a few words.
Some of you may have noticed that “Mary” is often the
opposing voice in my posts. It may seem like I’m picking on her. I am not. It
just so happens that most of the males I used to have these “discussions” with
have de-friended me and blocked me on Facebook. You may remember “Richard” and
“Gomer” from way back. They are little bitches. “Mary” has bigger balls than the both
of them. I just
happen to comment on whoever posts things I think are ridiculously full of
shit, and “Mary” at the moment seems to be fulfilling that requirement the most
often.
Thanks. Now, on to the show…
It may not seem like it due to the amount of blog posts I
generate with these, but I don’t comment on a lot of the posters people put up
on Facebook. If I did, I’d need to make it my profession. I’m not sure if
anyone’s hiring Professional Facebook Commentators, though. But some stuff is
just so insultingly ignorant of facts that I NEED to comment and I am unable to
NOT comment.
If you don’t recall, this incident took place in July of
last year.
Enjoy…
Mary
Bill Mancuso
No one is preventing these homophobic bigots from expressing
their freedom of speech. And pointing out their blatant anti-gay speech is not
a lie. They even admitted to being "guilty as charged." And the
freedom to not patronize their anti-gay establishment is not fascism. It is
exercising freedom of speech. [Free-market
capitalism at its finest, to be more precise. A Conservative’s wet dream. Of
course, if free-market capitalism negatively impacts them, then it’s fascism.
That’s the problem with people who inherently do not understand the concept
that words have definite meanings. They just flip the argument onto you. That,
and they’re butthurt crybaby bitches when things don’t go their way. My
favorite “flip attack” is when they whip out “nigger” and you say “that’s
racist” and they reply with “another lib playing the race card again.” But I
digress.]
Why do you feel it is ok for Chick-fil-A to exercise their
freedom of speech regarding gay people, but when gay people and those who stand
for civil rights do the exact same thing regarding Chick-fil-A, you deem it
'fascism?'
Kirsty
Those are two different issues. Wtf Mary? What they are
doing is wrong. They are not just exercising freedom of speech; they are
discriminating against gay people. It is not a choice to be gay, and it is not
an easy lifestyle to endure. We do not need people making it worse, we are
supposed to be moving in the opposite direction. It is a violation of basic
civil rights!
Mary
In the United States people are supposed to be able to
express their opinions. But in Chicago, Boston and other U.S. cities,
politicians are actually promising to keep any more Chick-fil-A stores from
opening because their CEO does not support gay marriage, and that crosses the
line. [They’re hollow promises. They can’t actually
do it. Also – contributing million$ to anti-gay legislation that proposes to
execute gay people for being themselves – that’s not considered crossing the
line?] When politicians threaten to ban a business from their cities
[They can’t.] just because the CEO does
not hold the “politically correct” position [By
“politically correct,” do you refer to “not executing gay people?”]
on a social issue that is an attack on the freedom of speech of every American.
[Here we go. Hold on, this ride gets bumpy and has
many hairpin turns.] You see, the truth is that the enforcers of
political correctness in America are very “tolerant” except when somebody
disagrees with them. The politically correct control freaks that are trying to
ban Chick-fil-A from their cities would try to ban Chick-fil-A from opening any
more restaurants in the entire country if they had the power to do so. The goal
of these politically correct control freaks is to intimidate. [Executing people for being gay – that’s apparently not
intimidation.] They want to end debate on these social issues by
shutting down the free speech of the opposition. In the end, if America
continues to go down this path it will end up looking just like many of the
other totalitarian regimes throughout history where free speech has been
banned. Once again, in America everyone has the right to say whatever they want
to about Chick-fil-A. However, when politicians try to ban a company from doing
business in their areas because one of the company executives does not hold the
“correct” political view about an issue that is a major problem. This has
NOTHING to do with my stance on being gay. My acceptance of your lifestyle is
because you're my sister, I love you, and I always want you to be happy, it's
NOT because I feel the need to be politically correct. Believe it or not, there
is a HUGE difference.
And by the way....I will continue to go to
Chick-fil-a....not because they are for, or against gay marriage, or for any
other stance any of their workers, managers, or ceo's take....I will continue
to go there because they are in the business of chicken....and they have good
fucking chicken.
Bill Mancuso
Civil rights have NOTHING to do with "political
correctness." A civil right is not political except to those defending
bigotry who try to make it political.
They make a false equivalence between hatred and intolerance with a civil right
just to give a fake notion of an equal argument for bigoted homophobic hate and
intolerance. This is what you’re doing now. Do you also support the opinion
that blacks and whites shouldn't get married? The opinion that women and blacks
shouldn't have the right to vote? That blacks should still be considered only
3/5ths of a person? Do you believe that Martin Luther King, Jr. was a Fascist
for wanting to be treated on par with whites? Do you support the belief that
gay people should be put to death? These are all opinions as well. Let me put
it to you in a way you might understand: If Chick-fil-A said rottweilers were
nothing but vicious killers and must be terminated no matter what, would you support
their opinion and continue to eat at their restaurants and help them use your
money to donate to anti-rottweiler organizations? And anyone who said that they
are wrong and that it’s the trainer that trains them that way – would you
consider them Fascists?
“If America continues to go down this path it will end up
looking just like many of the other totalitarian regimes throughout history
where free speech has been banned…?” Gee, spout extreme fear-mongering nonsense
much? Again, why do you believe it is OK for Chick-fil-A to express their
opinions of hate and fire gay people because they hate them and donate money to
anti-gay organizations, but those in support of civil rights equality who don’t
want bigoted businesses in their cities are the ‘politically correct
totalitarian regime Fascists?’ I think you may be confusing just who is trying
for that totalitarian regime you fear so much.
It all comes down to this: it is a Constitutionally
protected right to express bigotry and it is a Constitutionally protected right
to express equality. The only difference is your choice. And you’ve chosen to
stand with bigots and claim that the notion of equality is a Fascist notion.
Chick-fil-A won’t hire people if they are gay and they do
fire them if they find out they’re gay. Not if they are incompetent workers or
late all the time or some other such actual fire-able reason – just gay. Just
because they exist. Why do you now support hateful intolerant homophobic
bigots? You didn’t used to.
And in that big book that bigots like to use to justify
their bigotry, in the very same chapter of the Old Testament, Leviticus, where
it says man shall not lay with man, it also says it is a sin to eat pork.
Chick-fil-A serves pork on their breakfast menu. Aside from being small-minded
intolerant homophobic bigots, they are hypocritical assholes to boot.
(Leviticus also says it’s a sin to wear clothes made of a blend of fabrics and
a sin to plant seeds from different plants in the same garden, so how credible
is their authority on reality?)
So, go to Chick-fil-A. Support bigotry, hate and
intolerance. It is your Constitutionally protected right. No one will stop you.
But they will know where you stand.
Oh, and on a related bigotry note, this one of misogyny,
Chick-fil-A often also fires women for no reason other than they have children
because they should be stay-at-home moms. Firing women who support their
children. Yay for Chick-fil-A. Welcome to 1952. [“Christian”
moral authority in action.]
Mary
Bill, please stop putting words in my mouth. You have NO
idea what my own opinion is, because I haven't given it. [Yes, I do because you have. It’s the entire reason behind
this dialogue.] The reason for my post and what I have written has
nothing to do with my personal opinion, [Huh?]
but rather the RIGHT to be able to express opinions without falling into a
political agenda. Everything you wrote is irrelevant to any and all of my
reasons and opinions. No one had a problem with them closing on Sundays since
the 60's due to his biblical belief of "a day of rest"...... I'll
make one thing clear, I am certainly not anti-gay or a homophobe, nor do I
support bigotry. Mr. Cathy has the right to express his opinion. Gay people
everywhere have certainly gone to extremes to express their opinions. [To be treated equal? FUCKING EXTREMISTS!]
Bill Mancuso
I did not put words into your mouth. You posted a sign that
claims people fighting for civil rights are Fascist and people fighting against
civil rights are expressing Constitutional freedom. If this 1950’s
backward-thinking bigotry is not your
opinion, then why did you post it?
I understand the reason for your post is that Chic-fil-A has
the right to express their bigoted opinion. I have agreed with you 100% on that
issue. But you exclude anybody’s opinion that goes against that bigoted
opinion. Again - Why do you believe it is OK for Chick-fil-A to express their
opinions of hate and fire gay people because they hate them (which directly
harms people), and donate money to anti-gay organizations (which directly harms
people), but those in support of civil rights equality who don’t want bigoted
businesses in their cities are the ‘politically correct totalitarian regime
Fascists?’ This double standard is laughable.
Oh, and they’re against women who need to work to support
their children, too. More backward 1950’s mentality.
Being closed on Sunday is not infringing on anyone’s civil
rights or freedoms and harms absolutely no one at all. [Except
their own profit margin.] Funding anti-gay organizations IS
infringing on civil rights and directly harms people. Stop making false
equivalencies.
Uganda. Where some of Chic-fil-A’s anti-gay money goes.
And yes, those damn gay people everywhere going to extremes
just wanting to have equal rights with everyone else – how DARE they.
I know you are not anti-gay or a homophobe nor do you
support bigotry. I’ve been in conversations with you before on this topic.
That’s why I am confused as to why you are making these clearly bigoted posts.
Mary
But what if I want a fucking chicken sammich on
Sunday??......
Stacy
go to Boston Market!
[Prepare yourself. This is a
perfect example of someone who is not seeking the truth but instead searching
for “information” to copy and paste that backs up their misinformed opinion.]
Mary
There are two persistent lies about Chick-fil-a that have
been perpetuated through a variety of media outlets. Most of the time, the lies
are reported as quotations from another source, but they are rarely challenged
or fact-checked by the one reporting the story.
Lie #1: That Chick-fil-a discriminates against homosexuals.
Mayor Tom Menino gave this explanation for why Chick-fil-a
is not welcome in Boston: “You can’t have a business in the city of Boston that
discriminates against a population.” Likewise, the Alderman leading the charge
against Chick-fil-a in Chicago said this: “If you are discriminating against a
segment of the community, I don’t want you in the 1st Ward.” Are these
allegations accurate? Is it true that Chick-fil-a discriminates against
homosexuals? That claim is patently false. [Maybe on
FOX, but not in the real world. But that’s how the right-wing works. Just
demanding something to be true means it’s true – ignoring all the
incontrovertible facts to the contrary.]
In a statement that has been largely ignored by homosexual
activists, Chick-fil-a clarifies:
“The Chick-fil-A culture and service tradition in our
restaurants is to treat every person with honor, dignity and respect —
regardless of their belief, race, creed, sexual orientation or gender. Going
forward, our intent is to leave the policy debate over same-sex marriage to the
government and political arena.” [This lie was not
ignored. It was acknowledged as a lie, since this lip-service is the opposite
of CFA’s actions.]
This statement and the well-known track record of
Chick-fil-a are why even some opinion writers who support same-sex marriage are
now editorializing in favor of Chick-fil-a. The pro-gay marriage editors of The
Los Angeles Times write:
If Chick-fil-A were to refuse service to gay customers; the
city has a right and an obligation to prevent discriminatory actions against
its residents and visitors. But there’s no evidence that any such thing has
occurred.
Likewise, Eric Zorn of The Chicago Tribune is also in favor
of gay marriage, but he editorializes in favor of Chick-fil-a as well. He
observes that “Chick-fil-A, doesn’t… discriminate against customers or
employees” based on their sexual orientation.
Americans need to understand what is going on in this
debate. No one is being discriminated against at Chick-fil-a, despite false
reports to the contrary. [If you click your heels
together and repeat, “Chic-fil-A doesn’t discriminate” then their
well-documented track record of discrimination will disappear.] The
President of the company, Dan Cathy, simply expressed his point of view on the
issue of marriage—a point of view rooted in his [hateful,
extremist] Christian beliefs. And now at least two mayors of
America’s two leading cities are saying that they will use their power to
punish Chick-fil-a for those views. This is a moral outrage and a violation of
the first Amendment to the Constitution. Every American—no matter what your
view of gay marriage—should stand against this kind of tyranny.
Lie #2: That Dan Cathy made an anti-gay marriage statement.
This imbroglio [How to tell if
something is copied and pasted, 101: The use of words no one uses.]
began as a result of an interview with Dan Cathy that was published in the
Baptist Press. From what I can tell, the Los Angeles Times reported on the
Baptist Press story, and it went national. Subsequent reports in the national
media described Cathy’s remarks in decidedly negative terms. The Huffington
Post described his stance as “anti-gay.” [Because it
is.] CNN reported that Cathy responded “guilty as charged” to the
accusation that he opposes gay marriage. [Because he
did.] Time magazine had a headline that spoke of Chick-fil-a’s
“homophobic attitude.” [Dammit, media! Stop reporting the things we say amongst ourselves that we don't want the public to know about! That's bigot persecution!] Did Dan Cathy really plead “guilty as charged” to
accusations of having a “homophobic attitude” or of being “anti-gay” or even of
being against “gay marriage”? [Yep.]
The truth is that Dan Cathy never mentioned gay marriage or
homosexuality at all in the interview. I invite readers to read it for
themselves to verify. While Cathy’s remarks certainly have implications for gay
marriage, Cathy framed his comments in decidedly positive terms. [Hah!] Moreover, they were set in a context
that was addressing more generally the pro-family stance of Chick-fil-a—a
stance that has implications beyond the issue of gay marriage. [No. There are no implications beyond the issue of being
anti-gay. This is the one and only reason someone would oppose gays getting
married. They hate gay people. “Pro-family” is a not-very-secret code for “anti-gay.”]
The Boston Herald reported that Dan Cathy said that gay
marriage is “inviting God’s judgment on our nation.” In actuality, the Baptist
Press report said nothing about “God’s judgment.” That phrase was taken from a
radio interview recorded a month earlier on a radio talk show in Atlanta. And
in that interview, Ken Coleman wanted Cathy to talk about fatherhood and
family. So Cathy made some wide-ranging remarks about the family in general and
about his own father in particular—remarks which had no reference to homosexuality.
[So, when Dan Cathy said, "I
think we are inviting God's judgment on our nation when we shake our fist at
Him and say, 'We know better than you as to what constitutes a marriage,' and I
pray God's mercy on our generation that has such a prideful, arrogant attitude
to think that we have the audacity to try to redefine what marriage is
about," he didn’t say it? And the clip of this radio interview of him actually saying
it isn’t him actually saying what he actually said…]
[Click your heels together, bigots, and repeat after me, “He didn’t say what he said, he didn’t say
what he said, he didn’t say what he said…]
Cathy also emphasized how crucial it is for children to be
raised by both a mother and father. [An overtly
anti-gay statement.] As an aside, he mentions that that’s why he
believes it’s arrogant to try and redefine marriage. [Because
he’s anti-gay, hiding behind 2,000 year-old homophobic writings to justify his
hatred of gays.] It’s bad for children and invites God’s judgment. [Meaning, as a homophobe, he believes ‘gay people invite
God’s judgment.’] Cathy never says anything about homosexuality or
gay marriage explicitly. [Yes, he skirted his
bigoted opinion in public well. Many public homophobes do. Especially when they
want to be secret about it if it potentially could harm their profits.]
You will not find the words “gay marriage” or “same-sex marriage” anywhere in
this interview. Again, I invite readers to verify this for themselves by
listening to the audio below. The interview begins at the 22:00 minute mark. [It does not because she never posted a link to the
interview when she copied and pasted this nonsense. I wonder if she actually
read this article beyond its title, Two Persistent Lies About Chic-fil-A in the Press?]
I do not mean to suggest that Cathy’s position on gay
marriage is unclear. It is very clear that Cathy supports traditional marriage
as the union of one man and one woman. [But that’s
not anti-gay. Sure.] What I am suggesting is that his advocacy is
understated and respectful. It is nothing like it has been reported in the
media over the past week.
[If you wish to read this
entirely copied and pasted nonsense all over again in its original form, HERE
is the link. Yeah, I research everything. You can also find the interview
there. And yes, if you were wondering, Denny Burk, the original author of this
nonsense is a bigoted Christian right-wing gay-bashing homophobe.]
Bill Mancuso
Lie #1: All the gay people and women with children who were
fired for being gay or being women might differ with the lie that Lie#1 lies
about.
Firedoglake.com: Forbes: The Cult of Chick-fil-A – and how it boldly engages in discriminatory practices
Forbes: The Cult of Chic-fil-A: The fast-food purveyor seeks loyal employees and operators who believe in serving chicken is God's work. Careful screening of new hires keeps it out of trouble.
Forbes: The Cult of Chic-fil-A: The fast-food purveyor seeks loyal employees and operators who believe in serving chicken is God's work. Careful screening of new hires keeps it out of trouble.
Lie#2: So, SEMANTICALLY
he never said the words, “I hate gay people," so, your argument is that semantically, he’s a bigot just hiding his bigotry behind
Bible-talk. Sure. He’s FOR “traditional” marriage, but NOT against gays getting
married. What kind of bullshit double-speak is that?
Also - pumping millions into anti-gay organizations ISN’T
anti-gay? I guess you’re right, though. He never came out and directly said the words.
That lawsuit is irrelevant to this situation. In addition,
the lawsuit is first and foremost against the manager of the Chick-Fil-A, and
he should pay for his discriminatory actions, but it has nothing to do with
Chick-Fil-A's policies or procedures. Chick-Fil-A is of course listed in the
lawsuit for obvious reasons. It was the individual, not the company.
Bill Mancuso
What other proof of Chick-fil-A's blatant bigotry, hatred,
misogyny and discriminatory practices do you find irrelevant to your defense of
the bigotry, hatred, misogyny and discriminatory practices of Chick-fil-A?
Here are a couple articles from a year and a half ago:
Mary
You are totally disregarding my point. I have read ALL those
articles and more [Sure you have.]
.....furthermore, not anywhere in my posts have I said that Chick-Fil-A is NOT
a bigoted, discriminatory run company [She must not
have read the “Two Persistent Lies About Chic-fil-A in the Press” post that
she copied and pasted from Denny Burke: Bigoted Christian Right-Wing
Gay-Bashing Homophobe.]. You took a very simple statement regarding
freedom of speech and turned into every issue the company has had since the
inception of their business. Some actions I have agreed with and others I
certainly have not.....this is not what this post was about. My other point was
that I go to businesses based on their products or services, not because of
their political agendas, whatever they may be. Like I said....if I choose to
buy a chick-filet-a sandwich, it's going to be because it's a delicious fucking
sandwich. If you view that as idiocracy, well, then, I'm an idiot. But I have
the right to be an idiot.
[Here’s the part in the
conversation where I often have to recap the conversation because my opponent
claims they didn’t say any of the things they said. I find this part amusing.
Sometimes, I even point out that they can scroll up and read their own words
that they claim they never typed. That’s even more amusing. This also means the
conversation is over, since they have nowhere to go from here. Unless they want
to deny once again that they said the things they said. But they’re too tired
at this point from twisting themselves into a pretzel trying to be correct.
Facts tire people out.]
Bill Mancuso
Ok. But see, here's the problem: That's not at all the point
you made by posting that CFA picture. That picture says, in order:
1.) “It’s not hatred to say what you think.” That’s a lie because what CFA thinks about gay
people is purely about hatred.
2.) “It is hateful to accuse others of homophobia.” That is a lie because it is not hateful to point out
a fact. Just because CFA doesn’t like being called the homophobes that they
are, doesn’t mean that it’s hateful. [In
other words, “WAAAAH! STOP PERSECUTING US FOR PERSECUTING FAGS! WAAAAAHHH!!!]
3.) “…when that is a blatant lie!” No. It is not a blatant lie pointing out the fact
CFA is owned by homophobes and operates on the principle of homophobia and
hides their self-righteous bigotry behind the Bible.
4.) “The right to say what you think is just that, a
right. To deny that freedom is Fascist!” Nobody denied CFA of expressing their bigotry. Ever. They’ve been doing it for years. But accusing
people of being Fascists who believe bigotry is wrong and CFA should stop that
practice is just extremist word-salad nonsense. “Fascist” has an actual
definition. You can’t use it just to make people seem bad if it has nothing to
do with the situation.
So, you see, there is no freedom of speech issue regarding
CFA. This picture is nothing but a smoke-and-mirrors deflection of facts and
trumped up bullshit that tries to make homophobic bigots look like they’re in
the right and civil rights defenders look like assholes. And it has nothing to
do with politics. This CFA picture tries to make it an issue of politics by
dragging in the First Amendment even though no one’s freedom of speech was
prohibited.
Then in your first response, you went off the rails talking
about false equivalencies of tolerance and intimidation by politically correct
control freaks and shutting down free speech of the opposition and future
American totalitarian regimes. Yikes. Talk about utter nonsense. (When George
W. Bush corralled First Amendment protected, peaceably assembled protesters
within fenced-in cages 10 miles away from his speeches, was he being a
politically correct control freak shutting down free speech of the opposition?
Or was he just being a patriotic freedom lover? When the NYPD, LAPD, Davis PD,
SFPD, and dozens of other police departments beat, gassed, shot, fenced-in and
arrested the First Amendment protected, peaceably assembled Occupy protesters
and news reporters covering the police brutality, were they politically correct
control freaks shutting down free speech of the opposition? Or were they, too
just being patriotic freedom lovers?)
Then I said it is a Constitutionally protected right to
express bigotry and it is a Constitutionally protected right to express
equality. It was just a matter of whose side you stood on. And you had every
right to go to CFA if you wanted to because no one was stopping anyone from
saying or doing anything.
Then after you clearly expressed your opinion, you accused
me of putting words in your mouth because you said you didn’t express your
opinion. I did no such thing.
Then you posted what I can only believe was written by the
CFA marketing department denying all the intolerant bigoted homophobic things
that they, for a well-documented fact, actually do. And then you said that the
irrefutable proof to the contrary that I posted was irrelevant.
And in the middle of all that, you posted that you just
wanted a chicken sandwich.
So, there you have it. You’re absolutely right. How could I
have missed your entire point of just wanting a chicken sandwich.
I apologize.
Mary
Can I have a vodka with my chicken sandwich, please? It may
help with the headache I have now.
Bill Mancuso
I would never deprive anyone of alcohol. Unless they plan on
driving afterward.
***** ***** *****
Christians hide behind the Bible to justify their
persecuting of certain people. When people point out that Christians are
persecuting people, Christians cry out that it’s Christian persecution.
I don’t think I need to elaborate further, do I? Let’s just
move on to the next segment.
How to Fold a Shirt in Under 2 Seconds
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